I've noticed the requests for help.  I wish you better luck than I've had.
I've been trying to locate distant relatives - as I've been told all
immediate family were killed off.  I've sent messages to the University at
Budapest, and to many Hungarian sites on the web.  No luck

If you find a resource, please let me know.  I would be very grateful.

My family are Hungarian but come from a place called (old hard to read
addresses) 'something' Lakos, and Lendava, Jugoslavia)

Names are:

Feher Vendor
Feher Peter
Horvat Stephan
Horvat Franc (who played in the violin)

It's all from 1927 to 1949.

Sandy
--
"There's No Business Like Show Business"

My personal thoughts on this is

1.      If the society didn't tolerate it, it wouldn't exist.

2.      If there weren't a market (the almighty dollar) it wouldn't exist.

3.      If people truly valued the worth, dignity and sacredness of each other,
it wouldn't exist.

4.      The Pron Industry has nothing to do with sex or love.  It has to do wit
h
exploitation of everyone involved.


My two cents,

Sandy

>Right, see today's AP news, the first paragraph of a news story is:
>
>"A new little French restaurant in town is serving up mild sadomasochism
>with the food, offering such fare as a birthday paddling, boot leaning or
>the chance to eat from a dog bowl at the feet of a whip-wielding mistress."
>


I rest my case!!

A few days ago I read an interesting piece of news. Some time ago a
journalist wanted to read the 1954 J.D. dissertation of Jozsef Torgyan, head
of the Smallholders' Party, and the dissertation of Gyula Horn that earned
him the now defunct title of "kandidatus." The former's degree was awarded
by ELTE (Eotvos Lorand Tudomany Egyetem) and the latter by the Hungarian
Academy of Sciences. The former dissertation has been stored at the law
school library of ELTE and the latter in the Academy's library. At both
places the journalist was denied of access. But Hungarian journalists are
learning: our journalist was not satisfied with the answers he received. He
went to the office of the ombundsman responsible for access to data and the
ombudsman expressed an opinion (not binding) that dissertations are--just
like in this country--copyrighted and deserve copyright protection, but
authors of dissertations don't have the right to deny access to
dissertations written by them. Although the ombudsman's ruling didn't have
the force of law, the library of the law school subsequently allowed the
journalist to look at the dissertation.
        For those of us who have been living abroad this whole incident
sounds a bit strange. A dissertation which cannot be read? It is almost a
contradiction in terms. Dissertations are written for others interested in
the topic to read. But, of course, the librarians/bureaucrats of these
institutions handle politicians differently from ordinary human beings. They
seem to be defending the politicians' "good reputation," and at the same
time saving their own hides from political repercussions. Old reflexes die hard
!
        So far I was not terribly surprised, and I was happy that Hungarian
democracy is beginning to function: after all, a journalist was brave enough
to go for a formal ruling on this subject. This is exactly what journalists
are supposed to do. What really surprised me was that in a
Hungarian-language discussion group where younger Hungarians are represented
very heavily this "secrecy" of dissertations didn't seem to make a great
impression. In fact, there were several people who felt that somehow
individual rights were wronged by allowing access to such a public piece of
intellectual property as a dissertation!
        As to the outcome. Mr. Torgyan's dissertation was nothing but a
piece of propaganda a la 1954. For some strange reason he wrote on
"international relations." A rather strange topic for a lawyer. The upshot
of his dissertation was that countries with internal difficulties often
resort to international adventures. This was definitely the case in the
nineteenth- and twentieth-century Russia. However, Mr. Torgyan's example of
Hungary in 1941 was a very bad example. The rest of the dissertation seemed
to have been praising the Soviet Union for liberating Hungary and for its
generosity toward the liberated countries.
        I would be curious what you think of this incident. ESB

On Tue, 12 Aug 1997, Joe Szalai wrote:

> On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, in Re: Flaming unsolicited sex-site advertisers, Sam
> Stowe wrote:
>
> > P.S.S. -- I recently read a description somewhere of Budapest being "the
> > Bangkok of Central Europe" when it came to the temptations of the flesh.
> > Any truth to this or is it simply good marketing?
>
> And I read somewhere that Budapest is second only to Amsterdam when it
> comes to the production of pornography.  Is there any truth in this?
>
> Joe Szalai
>
A friend of mine and former student tells me that much of the porn shot in
Europe today is shot in Budapest. he was telling me of an article he read
on line somewhere (sorry not to have the cite) that talked of an ex-pat
American watching something he rented and then recognized teh buildings in
the background of the tram that the couple were being filmed on.

The eigth district is supposed to be the area of the prostitution, so it
would not surprise if this is going on.

Darren Purcell
Department of Geography
Florida State University

Does that capsule review also leave out the fact that more than likely,
this explosion could be pointed to as yet another triumph of free market
capitalism? Production facilities usually move to the places were inputs
are cheapest? Where natural (read as human) resources are best in quality
and easy to extract/exploit?

Hmm, so Bucharest or Sofia would be the next logical choices for next
decades' porn capital? forgive the diatribe, I am preparing a reader for
course proposal on Geography of Law and Crime, and some of what I have had
to scan re: crime and sex, kidnapped women, and who makes the money off it
has absolutely sickened me.



Darren Purcell
Department of Geography
Florida State University

I sent the following message to USA Secretary of State Albright. Should you
agree with its content, you may wish to paraphrase and send her a similar
message. (e-mail:  )     Regards, Andy.
> =================================================================
Dear Sec.Albright:  The Slovak government's antidemocratic practices are not
news to your office. Particularly bothersome to the Hungarian minority  is
the series of irritating rules and even laws that don't help the country as
a whole, their purpose being to "play" to certain nationalist segments.
Foremost perhaps is the "language law", which forces the use of the Slovak
language in most official,and public communications. A recent outgrowth was
an order to school principals not to issue bilingual report cards (only
Slovak) even in schools where much of the instruction is in Hungarian.
Bilingual report cards in these institutions has been customary since the
establishment of Czechoslovakia. Both the edict and is progenitor, the
"language law" clearly conflict with both the 1992 Slovak constitution (see
esp.Art.26, 34 ) and Articles 14, 15 of the  1995 Slovakia-Hungary bilateral
treaty. By contradicting its own Constitution and a ratified treaty, the
Slovak government is casting a shadow on its own credibility. Besides the
obvious political fallout, such practices tend to discourage foreign
investment and depress a country's credit rating. All these in addition to
the causes making them ineligible for NATO or EU membership. Perhaps you can
point this out to them through channels.

Respectfully, Andy Vadasz

Darren Purcell wrote:
>
> On Tue, 12 Aug 1997, Joe Szalai wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, in Re: Flaming unsolicited sex-site advertisers, Sam
> > Stowe wrote:
> >
> > > P.S.S. -- I recently read a description somewhere of Budapest being "the
> > > Bangkok of Central Europe" when it came to the temptations of the flesh.
> > > Any truth to this or is it simply good marketing?
> >
> > And I read somewhere that Budapest is second only to Amsterdam when it
> > comes to the production of pornography.  Is there any truth in this?
> >
> > Joe Szalai
> >
> A friend of mine and former student tells me that much of the porn shot in
> Europe today is shot in Budapest. he was telling me of an article he read
> on line somewhere (sorry not to have the cite) that talked of an ex-pat
> American watching something he rented and then recognized teh buildings in
> the background of the tram that the couple were being filmed on.
>
> The eigth district is supposed to be the area of the prostitution, so it
> would not surprise if this is going on.
>
> Darren Purcell
> Department of Geography
> Florida State University
There appears to be a GIS of pornography?
Miklos

S or G Farkas wrote:
>
> At 01:52 PM 8/12/97 -0400, Darren Purcell wrote:
>
> >The eigth district is supposed to be the area of the prostitution, so it
> >would not surprise if this is going on.
>
> I recently drove from Budapest to Kolozsvar/Cluj. The highway near Budapest
> was full of prostitutes standing on the road, in their bathing suits. At
> least it was warm...
>
> Gabor D. Farkas
I drove many times the Route 4. It was the same, whether it was warm or
chilly. They are waiting for people driving towards Artand;-)
Miklos

S or G Farkas wrote:
>
> At 05:19 PM 8/12/97 -0400, Jeliko quotes the latest issue of the "Oil and
> Gas Journal"
> >

> I assume the companies affected have a monopoly, similar to most utilities
> in the USA.  Therefore their complaints against the price limits are not
> unlike those of the US regulated utilities when their prices are approved.
> Also, didn't those foreign investors know in advance what they were getting
> into? Did any of the rules change?
>
> Gabor D. Farkas
They thought, they knew. They bought run down companies, mostly with
high losses and high debts. "Retail" prices were way below the "normal"
energy market and the utilities were piling up losses. They were said,
that the price system will grant a return on investment of at least 8%.
They were also said that - at least in the case of the power - cost
covering prices will be introduced by Jan 1,97. A year ago, this was
postponed by the government to April 1.
The system is run down. Maintenance has to be cut back.
New construction is way below necessity.
Just one exemple : interests on debts due to accumulated losses
are not being recognized as costs by the price authority.

Rules, as disclosed in the tender documentation, were changed.

What I am not quit clear about in Jelikos "release" is whether
it was an annual price hike or a quarterly one. Due to the high
inflation rate it was envisaged to re-assess pricing quartely.
MKH

On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, in Re: Flaming unsolicited sex-site advertisers, Sam
Stowe wrote:

> P.S.S. -- I recently read a description somewhere of Budapest being "the
> Bangkok of Central Europe" when it came to the temptations of the flesh.
> Any truth to this or is it simply good marketing?

And I read somewhere that Budapest is second only to Amsterdam when it
comes to the production of pornography.  Is there any truth in this?

Joe Szalai

At a site called "The Other Cinderella" at
"http://www.designercity.com/porn.htm", the author has this to say about
Hungary's porn industry:

"This (a porno remake of the Luc Besson Classic, "Nikita") is one of a
dozen X-rated movies that are shot in Budapest every month -10 percent of
the European monthly output of over 100 films, according to the Hungarian
business magazine, Private Profit. Since the fall of communism, the
Hungarian capital has become a continental haven for UK, French, Italian
and American pornographic film makers, actors and producers for a variety
of reasons: low costs combined to permissive legal climate plus the
exceptional beauty and stamina of Hungarian girls. That Hungary's gene
pool spawns an inordinately high percentage of female beauties is lore
among visitors to this country, and echoed by erotic film makers. As a
measure of proof, the industry's biggest stars are all Hungarian women
masked under Italian stage names such as the infamous Parliamentary
candidate -La Cicciolina, Erica Bella, Simona Valli or Anita Rinaldi to
name a few."

Hmmm.  Low costs, a permissive legal climate and beautiful women.  What
more could one ask for?  Too bad the author doesn't mention the great
food.

Joe Szalai

At 01:52 PM 8/12/97 -0400, Darren Purcell wrote:

>The eigth district is supposed to be the area of the prostitution, so it
>would not surprise if this is going on.

I recently drove from Budapest to Kolozsvar/Cluj. The highway near Budapest
was full of prostitutes standing on the road, in their bathing suits. At
least it was warm...

Gabor D. Farkas

At 05:19 PM 8/12/97 -0400, Jeliko quotes the latest issue of the "Oil and
Gas Journal"
>
>" In Hungary, government imposed price ceiling increases on gas and power
>networks
>are raising the hackles of industry. Hungary's Ministry of Trade and
>Industry recently disclosed results of a long awaited price review requested
>by foreign investors.

I assume the companies affected have a monopoly, similar to most utilities
in the USA.  Therefore their complaints against the price limits are not
unlike those of the US regulated utilities when their prices are approved.
Also, didn't those foreign investors know in advance what they were getting
into? Did any of the rules change?

Gabor D. Farkas

At 03:27 PM 8/12/97 -0700, Sandy wrote:

>2.      If there weren't a market (the almighty dollar) it wouldn't exist.
>
>3.      If people truly valued the worth, dignity and sacredness of each other
,
>it wouldn't exist.

Right, see today's AP news, the first paragraph of a news story is:

"A new little French restaurant in town is serving up mild sadomasochism
with the food, offering such fare as a birthday paddling, boot leaning or
the chance to eat from a dog bowl at the feet of a whip-wielding mistress."

Charly Vamossy writes:

>Actually, tulips were introduced to Europe in the 15/16th centuries by the
>Turks (along with coffee) through rump Hungary and Austria, their most
>immediate western neighbors.  Tulipmania spread through Europe like
>wildfire and prized bulbs went for astronomical sums.  Eventually the tulip
>futures market collapsed and the flower bulbs returned to a more humble
>status.  The simple shape of the tulip found its way into Hungarian folk
>art and the tulip bulbs found a most hospitable home in the westernmost
>Hapsburg holding, Holland.  The Dutch also use the tulip as a frequent folk
>motif in their decorations.  Some of the round "house blessings" you see in
>the Pennsylvania or upstate New York Dutch homes always have tulips in
>them, reminding me very much of Hungarian folk art.


Sorry, but just because tulips became popular in the 15/16 century in
western Europe, it does not mean that was the first time it was introduced
into Hungary also. There are tulip motifs in extant but older than 15/16
century artwork showing tulips from Hungary and in other nearby areas. I
have seen extensive use of the tulip motif also in Sinkiang among the
Uyghurs. They also claim that it is a very old usage. (I am not trying to
create any direct relationship between the Hungarians and the Uyghurs, just
pointing out some cultural similarities, like tulip embroidered pillows
piled high on beds in the "clean" room.) It is possible that the Hungarians
got familiar with tulips
from the Turkish tribes, except it was most likely not from the modern
(western) Turks who were involved with Hungary in the 15/16 century.

Regards,Jeliko

>From the latest issue of the "Oil and Gas Journal"

" In Hungary, government imposed price ceiling increases on gas and power
networks
are raising the hackles of industry. Hungary's Ministry of Trade and
Industry recently disclosed results of a long awaited price review requested
by foreign investors. Adjustments are 11 % for gas and 4 % for power,
effective July 1. Annual infalation is 20 %, so the raise represents a
freeze for gas distributors and a net drop for power.
Hungary's MOL has lashed out at the price increases. CEO Zoltan Mandoki
criticizes the gas increases. He says MOL wanted a permitted hike in excess
of 20 %, adding that the Energy Office price calculations incorrectly assume
that MOL pays at least 10 % less than it does for imported Russian gas, or
0.273 c/cu. ft, instead of 0.313-0.318c/cu ft, the correct figure for 1997."

Regards,Jeliko